Castillonis vs. Spectabilis

[needmore]

Can anyone growing both of these species tell me of clear cut differences between these 2 - Castillonis vs. Spectabilis? I am supposed to have both and for the life of me, I can tell no difference. They started shooting at the same time, the shoots look identical to me and the Castillonis seems to have strong hardiness. I've been focusing on ligule, blades, auricles, striping etc and they match all the way. I've only had the Castillonis for 2 seasons so maybe the shoots will change with maturity? It looks like this years have reached around .75 inches and might get to 15 feet tall, so it has some good bones in there. The Castillonis does sem to have more cream striping on the foliage leaves but that is not much to go on. Last year I remember noting that the shoots looked like photos I've seen of Bambusoides shoots and the possibility of it being mis-ID's did not cross my mind but now the shoots look very different than last year

[Markj]

These should be easy . The bambusoides is a smooth and glossy culm whilst all the Aureosulcata forms are rough, with a fine sandpaper feel.

Brad, on another note; do you know if Ph. decora has a rough culm surface?

[needmore]

Yes, I've tried the rough culm test, thanks for the reminder - I have 4 Spectabilis plantings, 2 have rough culms 2 have smooth

The Castillonis seems to have the rough, I'll check again.

I'll also check the Decora next time I'm up the hill...

[Iowaboo]

Yes, I've tried the rough culm test, thanks for the reminder - I have 4 Spectabilis plantings, 2 have rough culms 2 have smooth

The Castillonis seems to have the rough

Indeed, its sounding more confusing more and more. Too much bamboo, bamboo overload.

[Markj]

I've just looked at both forms here and not counting the major climate difference, a few points do spring out.

From standing 10 feet away the Bambusoides looks different, the branches are much longer and the leaves bigger, which also means the sulcus is deeper than the other although the culms are the same size. There dead easy to tell apart here as the bambusoides forms are late shooters, not shooting to late July whilst the Aureosulcata forms will shoots around now.

All in all not a lot of use perhaps I'm best just lurking

[needmore]

Markj, you're more than lurking and I appreciate the help. I 'refelt' the culms and I would say that I do feel the dimpling going up the Spectabilis but not on the Castillonis, BUT, the Cast is very fuzzy right now and it feels rough due to the fuzz, which is clearly visible on the new culms after the sheath drops off, last years culms no fuzz. The Spectabilis is quickly turning that rich, deep burgundy but seems fuzzless and the Cast is much less so. To make more confusion, one of my Spectabilis plantings is just now sticking sheath blades above the soil line while other plantings have shoots approaching 7 feet, the Cast at 5-6 feet - totally a soil temp thing so shoot timing is no help. I think that FoxD is coming out in the morning and I'll get his opinion on these guys.

I checked out the Decora and on the up, there is a roughness but not a dimpling like Aureosulcata, much finer but it's there just the same. The shoots of the Decora are pretty easy to ID, looking only like Brachy Densf a little bit. Mine is just now starting to poke shoots and I'll try to post you a pic if they size up enough before I leave Tues AM.

[kstanwick]

Hmmmm, interesting and i never thought of it until you mentioned it. I got my castilion from Fred. I also got a madake from him too. I am assuming that they would both shoot about the same time. My madake is barely alive...no real growth or shoots.... however on the castilion, one nice size shoot and a smaller pencil size. I wonder if the castilion is actually a spectabilis...I trust freds word but i t might be possible.

[needmore]

Mine came from Fred as well and that is why I'm assuming it is properly ID'd as Castillonis.

[kstanwick]

maybe one of us should email fred and ask for a verify or find out his source..does he have both?? how are his performing?? Stuff to that nature....If they are that diferent it should be easy to tell the difference. Personally i was suprised to see how it is doing compared to my other z7 boos...Spectabilis would make more sense for me....

[needmore]

Top photo is the Castillonis (I hope)


<img src="http://needmorebamboo.com/photos/2006castll.JPG">


2nd photo Spectabilis

<img src="http://needmorebamboo.com/photos/2006spect.JPG">

[hotchkiss]

[img]<img%20src="http://www.bambooweb.info/images/bamboo ... 'Castillon'">[/img] [img]<img%20src="http://www.bambooweb.info/images/bamboo ... 'Castillon'">[/img] [img]<img src="http://www.bambooweb.info/images/bamboo/castillon1.JPG" alt="PHYLLOSTACHYS bambusoides 'Castillon'">[img]
Brad, here are pictures of Castillonis at my place in Fort Valley. It does not look like your castillonis. The color of the background and the density of the spotting vary with the size and age of the shoot. They are very similar to Ph. vivax and Ph. viridis in appearance. They shoot after vivax but with viridis. Mature plants are very susceptible to rust, thread scale, and noxious mealybug and foliage can look bad in the fall. Sorry about the large size. I will learn to shrink before posting another picture. I was just excited to get closeups that were not blurry. Our spectablilis looks very similar to both pictures you posted.

Mike

[needmore]

Mike, thanks for replying, I appreciate it.

Other than the spots on the culm leaves, what else are you noticing that makes it look more like Spectabilis to you? Your closeup of the ligule, auricles, etc looks exactly like a close up view of my Castillonis but then there's the spots... I'd really appreciate hearing the differences you see, I'm not disagreeing with you, I just don't see them other than the spots and I'd like to understand this better.


As stated above, I swear that last year the culm leaves were spotted and the blades looked like your photos but not this year?????? I'm baffled, as I distinctly remember looking at the shoots last year and clearly noticing the Bambusoides characteristics (that I see in your photos) that are totally missing this year and I remember noting that the culm leaves reminded me of Vivax with the spotting and Viridis with the arching. One thing I am watching for is the blades to start to arch downward as the shoot elongates - such as in your photos and as you say, Viridis-like, but thus far at a height of about 7 feet they are still fairly vertical.


It is not possible that any of my Spectabilis plantings have run into to Cast bed either but I posit no explanation as to why the shoots a year older would less like the purported species than they did a year earlier.


Kurt did you happen to check with Fredg to see if it is possible that we actually have Spec instead?

[needmore]

Mike, one other thing - my Castillonis has visible fuzz at sheath fall, you can see it clearly in the sunlight and feel it as well. The Spectabilis does not appear to have any fuzz at all by touch or sight. This is the biggest difference I can discern at this point.


At the point of shoot maturity when my Castillonis photo was taken, the fuzz was there a couple of inches above the node on the lower nodes where the magenta is starting to show but the last year culms are smooth.

I guess I'm asking you to ahhh,....feel your culms on the new shoots if you don't mind

[kstanwick]

I'll shoot out an email to Fred today. My one decent size shoot looks nothing like what is in the pics. It looks very close to the YG that i have. I am betting that is what we have. Fine by me BTW...

[kstanwick]

I asked Fred to chime in and to read the thread. hopefully he will.